Clockwise from left: radio host Mike Smyth sits with BC Green Party Leader Sonia Furstenau, BC Conservative Leader John Rustad and BC NDP Leader David Eby during a debate at radio station CKNW, in Vancouver, on Oct. 2.DARRYL DYCK/The Canadian Press
The first and only radio debate featuring British Columbia’s party leaders ahead of the election saw them joust over affordability, health care and the opioid crisis, while trying to undermine each other’s credibility to form the next provincial government.
Wednesday’s debate on Vancouver radio station CKNW brought NDP Leader David Eby, B.C. Conservative Leader John Rustad and Green Party Leader Sonia Furstenau into the same room for the first time on the campaign trail ahead of the Oct. 19 vote.
The fractious and freewheeling hour-long debate hosted by Mike Smyth was conducted with open microphones, and the leaders frequently spoke over each other.
Eby raised concern about the views of Rustad and his candidates, asking whether Rustad agreed with one that “vaccines cause AIDS,” while Rustad accused Eby of telling “outright lies” about the Conservatives.
Furstenau, meanwhile, said her rivals were ignoring root causes of B.C.’s affordability and opioid crises, in favour of handouts and quick fixes.
Eby also repeatedly came back to a previous promise from Rustad to not use provincial resources to enforce federal gun laws that he called “an overreach by government.”
“I just find it astonishing that someone who says that public safety is a priority would take that vital tool away from police to enforce federal gun regulations against gangsters in our province,” Eby said, talking over Rustad’s retort that his position on gun control isn’t about organized crime.
“Handguns, John,” Eby said. “Are you hunting deer with handguns? With semi-automatic rifles? This isn’t about hunting.”
Rustad said his party would “go after the source” of gun and gang violence by preventing weapons from entering B.C. through its ports.
“Look, we have a premier who actually wrote the book entitled ‘how to sue the police,”’ Rustad said, referring to The Arrest Handbook, a legal guidebook co-authored by Eby for the Pivot Legal Society before entering politics. “You cannot take his advice on how to tackle crime.”
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The debate started civilly enough with a question on affordability, where Eby said cost-of-living issues had been “challenging” for households and that the NDP’s proposed middle-class tax cut was aimed at driving down costs.
Rustad agreed that affordability was the top issue in the campaign, and asked “why suddenly now” was Eby talking about tax cuts, while Furstenau said it was “fascinating” that neither Eby nor Rustad wanted to talk about the factors that drove unaffordability in the province, including “financialized” housing and a “backwards-looking” fossil fuel industry.
Eby then turned his focus on Rustad’s candidate slate, citing a social media post by Chris Sankey, the B.C. Conservatives’ candidate in North Coast – Haidi Gwaii, that suggested COVID-19 vaccines “cause AIDS.”
“When you can’t even bring yourself to say that that’s problematic, that you don’t agree with that, then how are you gonna run a health care system?” Eby asked Rustad, calling the situation “incredibly bizarre.”
It was an apparent reference to a post last October on social media platform X in which Sankey mentioned a condition he called “Vaccine Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome.”
When contacted after the debate, Sankey did not respond to requests for comment.
Sankey’s campaign manager Andrew Painter sent a written statement from Sankey that said the B.C. NDP “are trying to cancel me,” but he did not address questions about whether he believes vaccines cause AIDS.
Eby asked whether Rustad agreed with Sankey that vaccines caused AIDS and whether Sankey would have a role in health policy.
“I just wonder, John, about who’s going to be running our health care system,” Eby said during the debate.
Eby added that Rustad’s lack of condemnation of Sankey’s post should worry voters about how a B.C. Conservative government would operate.
“I wouldn’t trust John Rustad to run my Thanksgiving dinner conversation with the family, let alone a hospital where my kids have to be safe, where parents and grandparents have to be safe,” Eby said.
Rustad responded by saying, “I like how (Eby) attacks an Indigenous candidate,” referring to Sankey, who is a member of the Lax Kw’ Alaams First Nation.
“David Eby only wants to go negative and I get that because he can’t defend his record, he can’t defend what he’s doing,” Rustad said. “So, that’s what a weak leader does.”
In a post-debate interview, Rustad said he cannot speak for Sankey about his post but reiterated his own position on vaccines.
“My perspective is very clear, which is we need to make sure that when we’re doing vaccines of any kind in B.C., that they’re available, that they’re safe, and that people have choice,” Rustad said.
The three leaders also spoke at an event later on Wednesday at the Greater Vancouver Board of Trade.
When questioned by a moderator about his candidates’ opinions, Rustad said his party has “candidates that have a variety of views, and I’m OK with that.”
Furstenau said during the debate that her own party was putting forward “serious candidates,” and that “there is a problem with candidates in the Conservative slate.”
She said the province needed people who did not use “Twitter and conspiracy theories” to guide their thinking.
When discussion turned to the opioid crisis, Rustad said the NDP’s policies of “safe supply and decriminalization have failed,” and the B.C. Conservatives would bring a “common sense approach” to the issue.
He said safe consumption sites would be turned into “recovery intake sites,” and that under Eby the government had become “one of the biggest drug dealers in the province.”
Furstenau said there needed to be a “war on poverty” and a continuum of care, instead of a singular focus on the “most severe” outcomes of the toxic drug crisis that has claimed more than 15,000 lives since the declaration of a public health emergency in B.C. in 2016.
The only televised debate of the B.C. election campaign will be held on Oct. 8.
Also on Wednesday, the provincial Conservatives announced plans to end the Insurance Corporation of British Columbia’s monopoly on basic auto insurance, in the name of competition and driving down costs.
The party has already pledged to end ICBC’s no-fault insurance model, which they say is unfair to car accident victims by curtailing opportunities to sue for damages.
The NDP government had moved ICBC to a no-fault system in an effort to repair the finances of the insurer, which Eby has characterized as a “dumpster fire” under the former BC Liberal government.
The leaders’ encounters come as Rustad has been told by a campaign working to end violence against women that organizers are withdrawing their permission for him to wear a moose hide pin meant to show support.
Moose Hide Campaign co-founder Raven Lacerte says in a letter that elected leaders have a unique level of responsibility to uphold basic standards of respect, “including respect for Indigenous Peoples and those along the gender continuum,” and that Rustad is “not upholding these standards.”
Rustad said after the debate that he will continue to support the principles of the campaign with or without a pin.
“So, when the Moose Hide campaign started, it started actually within a concept in my riding,” he said. “I’ve been supporting it. I provided funding when I was minister. We provided staff here as minister.
“I still support, and I will always support, making sure that men speak to men about honouring and respecting women and ending the violence against women.”